Warned a buyer about tariffs, but then they refused delivery over tariffs....

[electronic_dist_intl]

Had a US buyer make an offer on an item made in China. So I warned them about Tariffs that will be taxed and billed to them at the border in my counter offer that they accepted. Then they refused delivery over said tariffs being applied. There's no brokerage fee, it's strictly the tariff. So now what do I do? Do I wait for the shipment to get back to me or am I obligated to provide a full refund?

eBay needs to add some sort of warning or disclaimer for US buyers. The information including country of origin is there in my listings....

[recped]

There's no brokerage fee

If the package was sent through the mail there is no "brokerage" charge but USPS does charge US$5.95 to collect the duties from the recipient. (this is the same fee Canada Post would charge on a dutiable incoming shipment).

eBay needs to add some sort of warning or disclaimer for US buyers

They do! It's on all of your listings when a foreign buyer is looking at your listings. Of course you could also include this information / warning more prominently in your Description area. 

The problem with US buyers is that they have been accustomed to buying Internationally and almost never having to pay any duty, at least no duty on shipments valued at US$800 or less (was US$200 until 2016 (or 2018?). Since April when the de minimis exemption was eliminated for China made goods this situation has become a major problem for anyone from any country shipping goods from China into the US.

I currently have a notification in my description, my notification is to inform US buyers that I do NOT sell any China made goods and no additional duty will be charged if they buy my items.

In theory, in 2027 the US de minimis exemption will be going away entirely for ALL countries, if you think it's a problem now just wait until 2027.

The issue of buyers not paying Duty is nothing new, it's been an issue forever when shipping to countries that have a very low duty free exemption (countries like Canada which has always had one of the lowest duty free exemptions).

[Anonymous]

Interesting.

How does this affect the Chinese sites like Ali, teemu, etc. where virtually everything is made in China?

What about television sets, of which none are made in North America now?

What about the made in America car with a Chinese made air filter?

If I sell a radio for example, how can I guarantee it hasn't got a made in China capacitor hiding in there somewhere?

The world is getting stupider because of one person who just can't deal with getting his butt kicked by some some other country and who has to set up roadblocks to make life difficult for everyone.

And, he calls us 'nasty' because we won't kiss his huge ....

Much better people have been taken down politically, or by 'the people', or by some nut with a huge chip on the shoulder and a weapon ...

[reallynicestamps]

Do I wait for the shipment to get back to me

Yes.

or am I obligated to provide a full refund?

Nope. Not a cent.

EBay regards Refused shipments as Undeliverable and does not require the seller to refund at all.

https://www.ebay.com/help/policies/ebay-money-back-guarantee-policy/ebay-money-back-guarantee-policy...

Now your magat buyer is also covered by the credit card they actually paid with,if they are bright enough to realize this. But eBay would be the third party in the chargeback so they might or might not succeed.

And if they paid with a gift card or a debit card, they can't reverse any payment.

Most sellers will refund the actual purchase price when the item gets back, but not shipping, eBay fees, taxes insurance, packaging costs, etc.

But it's up to the seller.

[electronic_dist_intl]

It can be rather frustrating. Now the buyer opened a return saying they weren't warned about tariffs (as previously mentioned they were warned) and that shouldn't apply since it's coming from Canada. Americans really don't know how their own tariffs work.... That said I've warned some buyers who have sent a message thanking us for the warning and they had no idea how it all worked...

[john_koenig99]

They probably voted for Orange Taco. MAGA can be quite challenged. 🙄

[lotzofuniquegoodies]

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@Anonymous wrote:

Interesting.

How does this affect the Chinese sites like Ali, teemu, etc. where virtually everything is made in China?

What about television sets, of which none are made in North America now?

What about the made in America car with a Chinese made air filter?

If I sell a radio for example, how can I guarantee it hasn't got a made in China capacitor hiding in there somewhere?

The world is getting stupider because of one person who just can't deal with getting his butt kicked by some some other country and who has to set up roadblocks to make life difficult for everyone.

And, he calls us 'nasty' because we won't kiss his huge ....

Much better people have been taken down politically, or by 'the people', or by some nut with a huge chip on the shoulder and a weapon ...

---

@Anonymous 

With Temu and Amazon (the only 2 I am familiar with) duties are noted on listing/charged at checkout so basically built into the price. See amazon variation disclaimer attached. This may/can vary slightly depending on if you use Amazon Prime....or not. (There could be a very small delivery charge added like 6.99. for anything that is being shipped from China.)

Shipping Policies

Please note that we pay all duties and taxes on the items you order. However, some delivery methods do not allow us to pay duties and taxes upfront, and the recipient may be charged. In such cases, we will gladly refund any charges applied to you over the cost of your original purchase upon receiving confirmation of payment.

[visual-sound]

Thanks for nothing to all the Carney voters! Elbows up - Knees down!

[recped]

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@visual-sound wrote:

Thanks for nothing to all the Carney voters! Elbows up - Knees down!

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Explain to me why you think Carney is somehow responsible for Trump tariffs.

[therealteecee]

Hi there! I know it's been a few months since this thread started, and I'm sorry for the necrothread, but I fear that with the current situation that prevents us (or maybe it's only me, but eBay seemed to imply that it was something much worse tied to borders) to use Canada Post for US shipment is going to make sales to US customers a lot harder.

While I do not have any returned product yet (or any buyer who refused the shipment, yet), I can see that the situation is going to be much much worse now since we cannot use Canada Post for the time being.

Last week, I sent a few products to US buyers using UPS as I could not longer create a Canada Post label once the item sold, and filed the duties forms accordingly and holy, one customer is going to have to pay 13 USD in tariffs and 24 USD brokerage fees for a 28 USD product. I told them beforehand that there could be additional fees, but it never occured to me that the fees would end up being higher than the product price. It's bound to make buyers angry, and even if it's obviously not our fault, we'll probably end up with a lot of issues with US buyers.

Any solution that doesn't involve simply not shipping to the US at all? I could use a third party label system (like ShipTime) but it usually means higher price and probably no integrated tracking from eBay, and ultimately, from what I could read, potential claims that the item was never shipped.

[recped]

You can use Canada Post you just can't buy the labels from eBay.

Anyone who ships to the US via a DDU (duties unpaid) service is just asking for problems. You didn't specify but I assume you used UPS or FedEx, if that is correct be aware that they will bill you for the brokerage fees and duties they paid on your behalf (under the new trump rules there are no drawbacks allowed on tariffs paid). If you bought the labels from eBay then you will have to pay these charges or you would likely have your eBay account terminated (and eBay will send your debt to collections). 

[triplecgirl]

I had this happen actually before August 27th  start date. Shipped 250.00US of  Chinese made craft punches to the US from Canada.  Sent UPS. Duties/tarriffs  charged were 93.00US plus 50.00 or so brokerage fees COD.  The buyer messaged me and I told her not to pay. I called UPS. Turns out if they refuse the parcel, the seller will pay the fees anyway. I paid the fees through refund. The buyer accepted the punches.  Later the buyer got a 36.00 US  assessment fee for for God knows what and they just informed me of it and said since I had really tried to help them, they would pay it.  I chaulk it up to a learning experience. Unless you know exactly what ALL charges will be before you ship the parcel, and the buyer agrees to paying, just don't ship. Not worth it. Really when you think about it, as a seller, I should know what all shipping charges will be before I send it off.  Remember the buyer can return product for any reason. I don't fault the buyer.
I just pad 93.00 of the US defecit. Not worth it at all to ship Chinese made goods to the US from Canada. Too bad.

[therealteecee]

Well, eBay forced my hand by preventing me from printing Canada Post labels and saying that it was a border issue and pretty much saying that we shouldn't use anything else than their labels if we wanted any kind of "seller's protection".

I don't see why I would be punished when I clearly stated that I am not responsible for tariffs and US buyers see that they'll have to pay import fees (and it's even stated for US users when they hit a Canadian eBay listing that there would be additional fees and that they're responsible for said fees). Why the hell would I be responsible for said import fees? Even eBay has it wrong then, and clearly mislead sellers as if we end up being the ones who have to clear and pay for duties, they should add the estimated duties + brokerage to the item sale value when the buyers pay.

As a buyer, never ever did a seller paid duty fees for me, and often was I hit with a ridiculously high duty/brokerage fee (despite me asking the seller beforehand to use USPS instead of UPS, and them not listening) and I never claimed anything. 

I guess I'll simply take the hit now, pay those rididulously high fees that should have been paid by the buyer and simply stop selling to americans from now on then. This seems like the most sensible thing to do. So basically, I lost my items, my time and my money.

[byto253]

Seller's protection has nothing to do with using ebay labels, it is not a condition of protection.  If someone implied that it is that really, really bad.

Canada Post is the best way to ship at a reasonable price to the US and to be sure buyers will not be dinged with extra fees.    

[therealteecee]

Sadly, it shows how uninformed some agents are as this is the information that was relayed to me when I asked a week or so ago. So, basically, note to myself : I'll never ask eBay for information about shipping anymore, and I should have read those community threads before as it contains up-to-date information and some hands-on experience on the matte.

Anyway, when it comes to dodging brokerage fees, there's no other option than CP/USPS and it obviously was my first choice and I would have used it if eBay didn't "lock us out" from printing CP labels at the time.

Now, as of today, is anyone able to confirm whether we can print labels for Canada Post through eBay while shipping to the US (and benefit from better pricing and estimates) or if we would still have to resort to using CP directly (or CP through a third party app) and then add the tracking info manually?

Thanks!

[ypdc_dennis]

All Canada Post shipping to the USA has to be tariff prepaid through Zonos. At this point in time that requires buying the label from Canada Post (either online or over the counter).  So no eBay discount, just whatever discount you can normally get from Canada Post.

Sold a book to the USA recently, cost about $4 more for tracked packet (ebay vs SfSB level 1 discount). No tariff cost since it was a paperback book. Took about a week to get delivered.

[byto253]

In addition to CP/Zonos,  Stallion and Chitchats Express also have good DDP options now as discussed in these threads.  Of course they need to be where you are.

https://community.ebay.ca/t5/Seller-Central/New-Stallion-DDP-US-Shipping-Option-Only-HS-and-COO-requ...

https://community.ebay.ca/t5/Seller-Central/Chitchats-No-Manufacturer-Info-Required-US-shipping-opti...

[therealteecee]

So essentially, through CP, the seller pays the import fees and tariffs upfront (which I wouldn't mind, if eBay made it possible easily for the buyer to pay upfront for the tariffs while paying for the item)? That's dumb, because we end up losing money to eBay fees as the tariffs cost have to be integrated in our shipping quote. 

So basically, from what I can understand and due to eBay inability to provide a proper system, we have to remove the automatic quote for US shipping, and instead estimate the potential Tariffs for every single item we put on, then put a fixed shipping price for all US buyers regardless of the actual location, and if we sell the item to an american buyer, create the label, pay the tariffs and absorb the loss if it ends up costing more than what we initially quoted for. And we get dinged by eBay fees over the whole shipping cost + tariffs, how wonderful.

So basically, we estimate duty/tariffs trough Zonos, get an estimate quote from CP, add those two numbers together and multiply it by eBay listing fees so that we don't lose money on tariffs. IMO, eBay should not make money on tariffs or tax, but meh, it seems like they don't care right now.

[snoopwiz]

2016 is correct sir.

[marnotom!]

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@therealteecee wrote:

And we get dinged by eBay fees over the whole shipping cost + tariffs, how wonderful.

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Believe it or not, no.  For sales outside of Canada, eBay uses your domestic shipping charge as part of the Final Value Fee calculation, although you will also have a small-ish international fee that you won't have for a sale within Canada. 

https://www.ebay.ca/help/selling/fees-credits-invoices/selling-fees?id=4822#section2

It strikes me that you'd be a seller who'd really like to use eBay International Shipping when it becomes available to you.  If that's the case, it's in your best interest to get your domestic shipping charges as low as possible as your buyers based outside of Canada will be paying both you and eBay to get their items shipped.